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Washington Women’s Heritage Project records, 1900-2000 
University of Washington Libraries Special Collections 
Sister Rita Carmen Bergamini 
December 12, 1980 
Cassette 2, Side 2 
 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:02 
Just a-- Sister Rita Bergamini, interviewed by Susan Ehlers for Washington Women's Heritage 
Project. December 12, 1980, tape two, side two. Okay. The doctor was going out of town? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  00:21 
Right, and as we were discussing that, commotion and that patient died, we walked right in and 
he did the section right there himself. Gee, I'll never forget that. That-- that baby lived too.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:37 
But that was-- pretty much the procedure?  
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  00:40 
Well, I might even remember it again, before or after, but, I mean, those were kind of things you 
asked me, what I remembered? I can remember those.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  00:50 
Okay, you grew up in California. How did you feel about coming up to the northwest? You 
know, whoever sent you up here? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  01:00 
Well, I like Seattle. [Inaudible]-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  01:02 
--did you have any sort of [inaudible] that it was going to be pouring rain?  
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  01:05 
No, I didn't. In fact, at home, Martinez is the sort of train center. They used to change trains 
going south or something, because that's where the end of the line goes over to San Francisco 
[inaudible] if you're going south, okay. But-- and we used to go down to the station when we 
were little, on some days and watch the trains, and the big trains would be coming up north and 
all that. Well, I like Seattle. I was here just a short time till '45 and I went to Portland, and I loved 
the city of Portland. I thought that was a nice place. And I love the northwest, and I love Seattle. 
I just think, you know, the natural beauty, the ferries. I like a little ferry ride Saturday, sometimes 
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we go on a mini vacation, like take a sack lunch, and go on the ferry, go on the other side and 
walk across. So beautiful. Five minutes, we're down at Lincoln Park, in the summer, as we can 
go down there and have a little picnic supper. I like Seattle, lots of things going in the arts and 
crafts, [?building?] arts and crafts. Lots of things going in the art museums. We have a beautiful 
opera house now. Repertory Theater. Pioneer Square, waterfront... You know, things like that. 
And San Francisco has changed so much, it used to be my favorite city but [inaudible] anymore. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  02:33 
Too edgy? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  02:34 
Yeah. As far as living in.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  02:41 
Were-- when choosing to become a nurse and a nun, why did you choose this particular order? 
Now, I know, I know there's a nursing order more interested in nursing, but there are other 
nursing orders, aren't there? Or simply was the nearest one? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  02:57 
Okay, that's a good question, because why did I choose? I actually, as I mentioned this girls' 
counselor, she suggested that we visit different schools of nursing for one thing. So I did. My 
friend and I, one of the students, girls in school, senior class, wanted to be nurses, so we just 
called. We went down to Stanford, we went up to San Francisco. We went to the different 
schools and looked around. And I came home and I said to my folks, I can see them in the living 
room, one night. I said, I'm going to Stanford [?button?]. And so they listened, and I can 
remember my mother said, Well, you know, Sister Evelyn went to Oakland, and we like the 
spirit there, at that hospital. We like it. And then they said, Fine, well, tell you what-- we'll help 
you if you go to Oakland, you know, we'll help you make your tuition. Well, I did a lot of 
babysitting, but I didn't have a lot of money for tuition or anything else. So the fact that they 
really felt that Providence, they like the spirit of that place, that hospital, and they thought that 
they liked me to see and go there and study for nursing. And the fact that if I lived there, that I 
would be financially supported to do that, well, sort of made that choice apparent. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  04:22 
Was there-- was any discussion, debate, or whatever, with your parents about your choice of 
career? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  04:28 
Oh no. Them, as far as the being-- coming a sister, as I realized, sort of an attraction-- deeper 
attraction to prayer, and really a desire, first of all, to finish nursing. I didn't want to cut that off. I 
thought I had started this, I wanted to be a nurse, and if I did enter, it would be in terms of 
professional nursing or whatever. I did discuss that with-- first of all, I thought maybe I'd like to 
go into something more contemplative, order. So I wrote around and inquired about religious 
communities in prayer, and I also discussed that with the chaplain there at the hospital, telling 
him what I wanted to do. And he said, you know, if you're a nurse, it's better that you be in a 
nursing community. He didn't say Sisters of Providence, he said a nursing community. He said, I 
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know some sisters who are nurses, who are-- they like teaching communities, and they're stuck in 
the infirmary, you know, and it's hard. So, he said, I would suggest that you think of a nursing 
community rather than an inactive community, because that seems to be what you're interested 
in, so... And it seemed that Sisters of Providence were an active community or a nursing 
community, and so I just simply wrote and said that I would like to be part of them. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  06:10 
Well, if you wouldn't mind, I'd like to maybe kind of run through a few of our standard questions 
about women in general. And as it says in the consent form, anything you don't want to answer, 
you don't have to. The thing about-- misplaced my regular list of questions, but got some of 
these. Some of them are duplicated from my other sheets here. Do you remember who made 
most of the decisions in your family, your mother or your father? [?Whether?] it was going to be 
50-50, or what? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  06:55 
In my situation, being the youngest-- my mother was 46 when I was born and my father was 66, 
20 years difference. So my father was kind of retired when I was growing up. And my older 
sister, Marie was the breadwinner. And perhaps she, as I can remember, was the one who seemed 
to make the decisions in the house, in a sense, whenever I wanted anything, my mother was 
always very supportive, you know, but I can't remember any predominant decisions made by 
either. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  07:37 
Marie was about 19 years old? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  07:40 
Well, Marie, that was-- a senior in high school when I was born, and then she went on. She was 
started to work at that point, and then later became the breadwinner, the one who really-- at that 
point, because my father retired and my mother... A little older... Was the real wage earner in 
there, in the [inaudible].  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:05 
Did you feel closer to one parent than to-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  08:09 
--I think my mother. Because she was very supportive. And-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  08:16 
--did your father being so old seem to have a-- be a problem? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  08:21 
No, not a problem, but it's just that I wasn't that close to him in a sense. But I was close to my 
mother, and I think what I loved was the art, and the music, and the gardening, and all those 
things that I love. You know, she was sort of that environment, and she was always very 
supportive and very positive, very encouraging--- like, she would come to school. I was always 
in the contests, like poetry contest in school, and I was always very active-- or an essay contest, 
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or something of public speaking. And she'd be right down there, you know, [inaudible] rooting, 
in a sense, she was there. And I remember once I was taking my laurels in Berkeley, and I-- 
telling her about that, and she said, You will do well. Yeah. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:12 
Which parent disciplined you the most? Or didn't you ever get into trouble?  
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  09:16 
I think I remember being disciplined once. They blamed me for putting black tar on the living 
room. And to this day, I never did it, and... okay? 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:25 
[laughs] Yeah.  
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  09:27 
There will be a day. No, I don't ever remember being disciplined, in a sense. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:34 
Are there any verbal or-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  09:36 
--no, no. I don't. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:39 
Were you closer to one of your brothers or sisters, more than the rest? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  09:43 
Probably Marie. Marie and I were always been great, great, great. And my sister, Yolanda, 
because we're interested in family history, and we're doing family archives, and letters, and stuff 
that... And Maxine. But probably Marie and I are the closest because-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  09:58 
--even though the [?enough of it ends?]-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  10:01 
--but we just used to-- Marie played the organ and I used to go over and sit with her, and listen 
while she played. And then go, if she had to do shopping or something. She always enjoyed nice 
clothes and everything. We were about the same size, so I always got her nice things, because 
she always loved nice things. Marie and I have always been interested in the same kinds of 
things, I think.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  10:27 
Did you feel there was much difference in the expectation of your parents on what the girls were 
going to do was differentiated from what the boys were going to do, or, you know, or even just, 
you know, what chores they were expected to do around the house, you know what I mean? Or 
did everybody have to do the dishes? 
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Sister Rita Bergamini  10:44 
I think I got the dishes most of-- [laughs] the reason that I entered was so I could get out of doing 
dishes. No, I used to-- but I always loved to cook. Not that I loved-- but didn't bother me to do 
dishes. As far as boys doing things, my older brother was not at home when I was growing up. 
He was in the service, I think he was in the Marines. But sometimes, I think Maxine would, she'd 
do a little bit more than I did in terms of housework and things like that.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:26 
The boys weren't expected-- do much of anything, like washing dishes or cleaning up, or-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  11:32 
--no, the boys didn't do much of the dishes. We did. The girls usually did the housework.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  11:38 
How about doing sort of odd jobs, like repairing lights, and-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  11:45 
--oh yeah, my brother was very creative, and he did a lot of things. I think he did a lot, like 
taxidermy and stuffing animals, and, you know, not that that was repairing lights, but lot of 
interests on the side, but I can't remember any problems. There were always plenty of dishes to 
do, and I think I was always at that end.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  12:22 
Well, okay, you are-- you did a lot of babysitting. 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  12:27 
I did. Had a card yesterday, you wouldn't believe it, from a lady from Medford. My sister went 
down there, and this woman now is volunteering in Medford at the hospital, and she saw the 
name, and then she said, Ah, you know-- you know Sister Rita. Anyway, she said, I got a card 
from her yesterday. She said, Remember, you used to babysit kids in California [inaudible]? Yes, 
I did babysitting. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  12:55 
Yeah, okay. When did you start doing that? How old were you when you-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  12:59 
--when I was in junior high in high school. Actually, my sister Hazel had these two small boys, 
and so-- Robbie and Wally, Robert and Wally. And when they would go to San Francisco, I 
simply managed to take care of them a lot. I loved it. And then I had a lot of customers in the 
babysitting. People would go out, and I would go over about five and probably do the dishes 
from supper, put the child to bed, do the ironing, and up to-- up till midnight, up till midnight, I 
get 50 cents and 25 cents thereafter. In those days, thirty, forty. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  13:39 
That was per hour for the whole time?  
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Sister Rita Bergamini  13:41 
For the whole time. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  13:43 
Okay, um. Let's-- this new way of running pin money, you know, more or less looking forward 
to trying to save up for an education? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  13:54 
Just for spending money on that. I remember if I wanted a coat or something, my mother would 
take care of it for me. I didn't buy big things because I didn't get that much, but the family sort of 
supplied what I needed. And when I went to the School of Nursing, Marie would let me use her 
charge account, and so I would just order what I wanted, and... 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  14:15 
Uh, the educational expectations. Was it expected that you would all at least graduate from high 
school? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  14:26 
Probably, but no, [?muster fudd?].  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  14:30 
There wasn't any expectation of going on to college, or whatever-- you're not sure? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  14:36 
My dad wanted me to be a court reporter or something, and my mother wanted me to go to the 
College of Arts and Crafts in Berkeley. And I mean, just, you know, sort of-- and yet, I didn't 
feel any pressure about me doing this or that. When I wanted to go into nursing, that was fine. It 
wasn't, you know, it was my choice, and it came to be supported by them.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:00 
Were there more expectations for the boys to continue with their education? Or are you not sure? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  15:05 
No, no, I don't think so. We were sort of free. I would say we didn't have a lot of pressure on us 
in terms of education. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  15:18 
I don't know why your parents originally came to this country. Do you? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  15:26 
Probably. When I was over in Italy, I went to the-- they call them communes there, biostatistic 
places, and looked up their baptismal records and-- to see why they left-- and not why, but it 
was, you know, their days leaving and all. And I can see why they came to this country. My 
father was not the first of that family. We had cousins in San Francisco. And when I-- when, 
after, I've been to Italy in '77 and see the country, and I can see-- it's sort of the climate. You 
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have the sun, you have the natural soil for the wine, the grapes, you have-- they brought the art 
and culture. In fact, it was the secretary to Mayor Alioto, who was there a few years ago in San 
Francisco, did the study of the Italians in the San Francisco Bay Area. And it really tells the story 
how they brought this Italian culture here. So it's kind of a little Italy, the fishing, the seaports, 
the whole thing. And so I can see why, once they were there and were able to establish 
themselves, that others would come. And so indeed they did, but specifically why they left Italy 
at that time, I don't really know. But at someday, I hope to do some more research on them.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  16:47 
Okay, looking over your life as a nun, do you have any regrets about it? Either in general, or just 
maybe a small regret about something you wish you...  
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  17:03 
None, none. None. I just-- I would do that again. I've always been very happy with religious life.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  17:14 
What are your feelings about what are termed, women issues, about equal pay, and freedom of 
lifestyle, and stuff like that? Have any specific thoughts about that? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  17:30 
Well, I think there's a matter of justice, you know? And I think that if women are doing jobs that 
are equal, in a sense, there should be equal pay. I think I read something about that the other day. 
You know where they line up as a 50% difference, or, you know, the percentage difference in a 
woman in the same jobs. I don't really-- can't say-- I think there needs to be a matter of justice in 
that.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  17:56 
How about-- you feeling about women going into what's called non-traditional work that is...? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  18:01 
Well, look at Mother Joseph. I mean, number one, and our sisters, you know, from the very 
beginning, they just were able to-- they managed the institutions they have today. Turned over 
huge medical centers to these lay administrators that are working with us. You know, because we 
don't have the sisters who are going into administration, they want to do everything, sort of like-- 
but the sisters were the ones who were free to do the kinds of things, and they were, in a sense, 
like carpentry, and sculpturing, and all that kind of-- the male traits, in a sense of like Mother 
Joseph and [inaudible] so they were free to do those things.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  18:45 
You feel a marriage might have actually been more constricting way of life? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  18:52 
You mean for me?  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  18:53 
Yeah. 
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Sister Rita Bergamini  18:55 
I personally feel that, as a sister in the Sisters of Providence, that by this challenging me and 
placing me in new positions that I [?cover?], I probably would never have-- it'd be interesting to 
know, but wouldn't have achieved the kinds of positions and been in the positions that I have 
been if I'm not in Sisters of Providence. You know, I don't know. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  19:24 
You feel-- ever feel like these administrative positions had a certain amount of authority to them, 
that they were unfeminine or anything of the sort? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  19:32 
No, no.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  19:36 
What are your feelings on women's rights about abortion?  
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  19:41 
No, I think that I would kind of go along with the right to life, that that individual should be 
granted the right to life. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  19:57 
And you mean the baby? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  19:59 
Right. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  20:12 
I don't have anything else for the rest of-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  20:13 
-- yeah, I know. Well, when you're ready, because I think-- really want to include, and that was 
really my reason for accepting, what we have here in terms of the history that would be valid, in 
terms of Washington state history, in terms of the Sisters of Providence. And especially Mother 
Joseph. In 1977, I did a-- at the University of Washington, we had a workshop. They received 
that grant for surveying archives throughout the state, and we put on workshops for people who 
were just interested. So, I was asked to do a slide presentation, or something on that archive here. 
It's that kind of thing that would tell the story of that, or I could take you through and explain it. 
And then there's a five minute tape on Mother Joseph I thought we could include somewhere in 
our meeting. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  21:13 
Okay. At the hand, at the moment, I don't have any more questions. So I'll shut this off. Sister 
Rita Bergamini, interviewed by Susan Ehlers. End of tape two, side two. Addendum to interview 
with Sister Rita Bergamini. Okay, one thing I want to ask you, are you paid for your work?  
 
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Sister Rita Bergamini  21:48 
Oh, yes, we are assigned a salary. And as the archivist for the province, I have a salary this year. 
$18,840, but it's paid half of it by the corporation and half of it by the religious community, 
because my services are to each. It's prorated about 50% in terms of the services. Now, I don't 
receive the check. It's a book transfer at the office. Each of our sisters is assigned a salary, has an 
agreement, but each sister, at the end of the year, presents a budget for what she feels are 
personal needs to the provincial superior. Which includes such things as personal expenses. 
Trousseau, office supplies, alms and gifts, long distance telephone, medical, pharmacy, dental, 
lectures, annual retreat, vacation, recreation, association, dues, travel. And then there's the 
boarding room figure. That is approved by the provincial. And then the sister is given that-- she 
makes a monthly report of the expenses and requests what she needs. So, in effect, the sister is 
given what she needs, and she's-- but she isn't given directly. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  23:23 
From what? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  23:24 
And this salary goes into the general fund, but then she's given... 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  23:28 
The clothing is called her trousseau, not being called the pride of Christ, but... 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  23:34 
Yeah, trousseau is an old word that means-- it's from the old constitutions, I guess. But that 
means your clothing. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  23:41 
Have they always received a salary? Or is that something that's new? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  23:44 
No, no, that's a good question, because it's only within the last-- I say it, since the '60s, perhaps, 
or maybe before that, about the '50s, that we're beginning to identify the salary as a contributive 
service. For example, when our sisters were hospital administrators and working as pharmacists 
in our hospital in the early days, say, from '56 up until the '60s, they did not assign that salary. So 
it was like, you know, not there in a contributed service. And-- so in some ways, they've tried to 
go back to identify the salaries in terms of the sisters' personnel, to make a good retroactive-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  24:23 
-- but they would supply room and board, and that was-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  24:25 
-- that was it, right. But you see, then you have a sister who is responsible-- in our province, we 
have to educate our sisters, and we have to provide for the retirement. So that has to come from 
somewhere. So that is the sister's salary. So within the last few years, as I said, that has been 
identified. So it goes into the community, religious community fund, and it's identified, and out 
of that comes the preparation of the sister, and out of that comes her retirement, and indeed, each 
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sister needs to be conscious of that in terms of is she contributing, you know, those who can and 
those who are able. 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  25:04 
What about the sisters that may work in someplace that may not-- someplace other than 
Providence Hospital or someplace other that is run by the sisters, and they receive a salary from 
that, does that go into the general fund? 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  25:17 
That's right, that's assigned too. And then again, each of our sisters, we have a personal budget 
program for our province that is our way in this modern day of working out the finances, so that 
if a sister, say two or three sisters, are living in a small house, they would budget for the group 
budget expenses, and they also budget for their personal expenses individually. And that's 
approved and then it's given to them as they need it to be there, but there is an approval. So in 
that sense, it's with permission and it's-- 
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  25:52 
-- whatever beyond their personal expenses goes into the-- 
 
Sister Rita Bergamini  25:55 
-- that's right. And then the sisters are also mindful of a simplicity of life and style, in terms of 
clothes, in terms of vacation, in terms of living, whatever.  
 
Susan Lynn Ehlers  26:10 
Okay. Thank you. Just to make sure got that one point. Okay, and I hope for real, this is to 
[inaudible] the interview. 